software

i was thinking about saving up for a rackmount setup. could somebody give me the low down on all you need and everything? i was thinking of a mesa preamp with like a line6 pod pro or something of the sort? i'm not very knowledgable about any of it so any info helps thanks.

Both a Mesa preamp and a Line6 POD Pro are preamps....you only need one, but you can use one if you want, though things will get a little more complicated.

Minimum requirements for a rack amp;

Preamp
Power amp
A rack to put it in
Cables to connect the pre to the power amp.

That's it....though there's plenty of other stuff (effects, switchers, routers, power conditioners, ect) that you can add to it.

Ok, you do not HAVE to have a power conditioner to make it work...BUT IMO it is THE most important thing to have. The minimum rack set-up IMO is the following

-Power conditioner
-Power-amp
-Pre-amp
-rack
-Cables
-Footswitch for the pre-amp

... and a speaker cabinet (or two)

i have a modest rack set up that i am pretty happy with .. it is all solid state and has shown absolutely bulletproof reliability and killer tonal flexibility for 10 years ...

power conditioner
rack tuner
rocktron pro gap preamp
rocktron intellifex effects unit
rocktron midimate foot controller
skb rack

carvin dcm600 power amp

(2) Boogie recto 1X12quot; cabs w/ 90w celestions

read up on rack stuff before you jump in ... and be sure that you are interested in knob twiddlin' ... the midi stuff is great for versatility, but you have to be willing to put in the time to tweak all the patches just as you need them .. SUPER appropriate for guys in cover bands ... if you are going to be playing out alot, you'll need to spend more money on road worthy cases and stuff ... but to just get into it, you can pick up some used sstuff for not too much money

cheers
t4d

thanks for all the info guys. what's a good 50-100w poweramp by mesa? i'm looking for gainy metal tone.

I have a pretty standard rack system, too, and it gives me a lot of flexibility. From top to bottom is as follows.....
1) Juice Goose Power Conditioner
2) Audio Technica 1400 Series Wireless
3) DBX 163X Overeasy compressor
4) Digitech GSP 5 (yea, I know, it's archaic, but the sounds are still tops in my book)
5) BBE Sonic Maximizer
6) Marshall 8008 SS power amp (80 watts per side)

This system is MIDI controlled and about the only modifications to each patch are varying degrees of distortion and echo. I've been using this system since 1993 (with the exception of the wireless). It's fallen off a truck, been run over, drowned (caught in a rainstorm), and it seems to just keep going.


Originally Posted by Clockwork_Orangethanks for all the info guys. what's a good 50-100w poweramp by mesa? i'm looking for gainy metal tone.With a rack system, the majority (if not all) of your quot;gainy metal tonequot; is produced by the preamp. The purpose of the power amp is to reproduce what it's given in a loud state. Mesa makes a few nice rack mount amps, but I'd look for a single or double space QSC, Yamaha, Marshall, Peavey, etc.


Originally Posted by Clockwork_Orangethanks for all the info guys. what's a good 50-100w poweramp by mesa? i'm looking for gainy metal tone.Mesa 50/50s can be found for about $300-$400US.


Originally Posted by HellionWith a rack system, the majority (if not all) of your quot;gainy metal tonequot; is produced by the preamp. The purpose of the power amp is to reproduce what it's given in a loud state. Mesa makes a few nice rack mount amps, but I'd look for a single or double space QSC, Yamaha, Marshall, Peavey, etc.Eh....in a rack system you produce gain the exact same way you do with a head. If you're into all preamp dirt with a head, you'll be the same with a rack....if your into mixing preamp and power amp dirt with a head, you'll be the same with a rack.


Originally Posted by screamingdaisyEh....in a rack system you produce gain the exact same way you do with a head. If you're into all preamp dirt with a head, you'll be the same with a rack....if your into mixing preamp and power amp dirt with a head, you'll be the same with a rack.No. The purpose of a power amp is to amplify the system (just like what you do with vocals). If you're using a guitar amp to amplify the results of your rack system (which is perfectly acceptable, too), then you can add dirt with that, but a power amp simply gives you more of what you're putting in.

I used to use a Marshall 9200 poweramp. I'm sure you can get 'em pretty cheap in the US... and they sound pretty darn good with an old MP-1 as a preamp

Actually a power amp designed for a guitar rig is quite a bit different than a power amp designed for PA applications. Guitar amps whether in head/cab or combo form have both a preamp and a power amp section. With guitar rack gear you have a preamp and a power amp, they just aren't hard wired together on the same chassis.

While the object in a PA amp is to get maximum power out with as little distortion as possible, most guitar rig power amps are designed to distort to some level by design just as the power amp sections in heads or combos are designed to.

If you are going to use a modeling preamp such as a Line6 Pod Pro it may be best to use a PA type of power amp so that additional distortion is not layered onto the tone but then again some folks might like the added warmth of a tube power amp designed for guitar. Thats all really a taste thing.

Being the owner of an all tube guitar rack I can guarantee that my Mesa 2:90 does distort quite a bit and when dimed and run 1/2 power with a clean signal from the preamp it actually grinds quite well.

Solid state guitar power amps can also be run into distortion depending on the design but I'm not a big fan of SS distortion.

how would a rackmount mesa vtwin preamp sound through a mesa 2:90 power amp?

stupid question about rackmount tuners, they have a mute button or something?


Originally Posted by Clockwork_Orangestupid question about rackmount tuners, they have a mute button or something?

Mine does (Korg DTR-1000).


Originally Posted by Clockwork_Orangestupid question about rackmount tuners, they have a mute button or something?

yes, most do ... but i would suggest a slightly better 'hands off' way of doing silent tuning ... run your tuner in the effects loop of your preamp ... then, write a 'patch' called 'mute-tune' that when you select it, it sends the signal to the effects loop (and hence the tuner) ... then, just dont hook up the ouput of the tuner back to the preamp effects loop return ... also, set the pre-amp's output for that patch all the way to zero ... voila, dead silent tuning at the tap of a foot button

note, all this assumes that you don't put anything in your preamp's effects loop ... i run my effects (chorus/delay/verb/pitch shift/etc.) in series after my preamp and before the poweramp, so this is no problem for me

hope this helps
cheers
t4d


Originally Posted by screamingdaisyNo sh*t!

You mean the purpose of an amplifier is to amplify things? You should get a prize for overstating the obvious on that one......BTW....I don't know why you quoted my post....at no time did I ever imply that a power amp was for anything other than amplification....you said quot;noquot;, then went off on a tangent that has nothing to do with anything I said.

My apologies. From reading the previous quote my understanding was that you were stating that you could be achieve a high gain (and therefore, some sort of power tube overdrive) from a power amp. Rereading the statement, I'm still getting that impression, but that apparently isn't what you were stating. Again, sorry for the misinterpretation.


Originally Posted by tone4daysyes, most do ... but i would suggest a slightly better 'hands off' way of doing silent tuning ... run your tuner in the effects loop of your preamp ... then, write a 'patch' called 'mute-tune' that when you select it, it sends the signal to the effects loop (and hence the tuner) ... then, just dont hook up the ouput of the tuner back to the preamp effects loop return ... also, set the pre-amp's output for that patch all the way to zero ... voila, dead silent tuning at the tap of a foot button

note, all this assumes that you don't put anything in your preamp's effects loop ... i run my effects (chorus/delay/verb/pitch shift/etc.) in series after my preamp and before the poweramp, so this is no problem for me

hope this helps
cheers
t4dthanks for all the advice, i understood everything except the patching.

i use the word 'patch' to mean a stored setting in the unit ... in many rack mount units of today, when you store your settings (as a 'patch') you give it a name .. usually, the unit comes with preset 'patches' that have names too .. so when you tweak the setting the way you like it, you save it as a patch with a name, then you can recall the patch via the midi controller

hope this is clearer - sorry for the confusion
cheers
t4d

ah, thanks for all the info. basically like a customized channel? this will all help in my project building a rack rig starting now haha.