software

OK, I'm still Jonesin' for a Shiva, but I know it's way more amp than I need, power-wise, and fear that it might largely be wasted due to volume constraints. So I keep reading and looking for a lower output quot;substitutequot; but with no opportunity to play any other candidates, well it just plain stinks. Throw me a bone on this one guys! Offer me some suggestions based on what you've had opprtunity to audition.

And... I just became aware that at some point, Reinhold made some EL84 based Shiva's, apparently at 15 watts. Has anyone seen or heard one of these - does it have a similar voicing to the current Shivas? I must know!!! A Shiva at 15 watts, can it really be?? Hopefully they suck, otherwise, I got one huge GAS bomb brewing.

Thanks, Scott

I just played a Shiva. 1 12 model with EL 84's. I gotta say, I'm with you. This is a Tone monster, but I also am concerned that it might be to much amp for my needs. I have yet to play thru anything else that had the versatility that both channels do on this Amp. I know this is not what you want to hear, but go buy it. Its a great Amp. I am looking very hard at this right now, but I am also considering a Deluxe Reverb (1967). Obvoiusly very differnt Amps, but I really feel the 22 watts of the Deluxe will work well for me. Suprisingly enough I like the Bogners clean alost as much as I like the Deluxe Cleans. The OD channel in the Bogner is just beautiful. Very versatile.

I have the EL34 80 watter and it sounds great at low volumes too.

I'm pretty biased. I'd own every product that company makes, if I could afford or need to. I've got an Ecstasy head with both the metalfront and canefront shell, the 4-12 Vin 30 cab, and the large 2-12 vin 30 cab. Amp shopping isn't even fun anymore because there's nothing that equals it. It's a more vital part of my setup than any guitar.

I haven't played the EL-84 Shiva, only the EL-34 and 6L6 versions. The only thing I can say about that version is it won't be as loud, and the lows won't be as big. I saw that one on Ebay and was intrigued. You won't be disappointed with any product that company makes.

So in general, what can you tell me about EL84 based amps. I have a feel for EL34 vs. 6L6 but am pretty clueless on EL84's.

EL84s generally have less headroom and have more upper mids going on. They're sweet because they tend to give up the goods faster and are generally in lower powered amps. They're by far my favorite tube. And 15w IS loud enough to give in most situations although you're not too likely to have enough headroom on the cleans, pushing through the rest of the band playing with humbuckers.

I often contemplated about that EL84 Shiva, but steered myself away because of the lack of knowledge on that particular model, figured I'd be safe with taking my money to Ben Fargen who custom tweaks stuff to the consumer's needs. I'm still intrigued in it and would love to hear any info or feedback on it. They're pretty rare and I've only seen a handful pop up so that adds to the quot;mysteryquot; of that amp

I have the highest respect for Bogner's, but I will never own one....(since I make my own amps)

One of the easiest ways to effectively cut power output on these and any other amp is to reconfigure the rectifier so that the plates only see about half of the voltage they would normally see...(granted, I'm shooting myself in the foot by disclosing this...but better tone is better quot;sharedquot; than kept secret..) Most amps can be configured to give much lower output levels by simply reducing the plate voltage..... The dilemma.... most people would never even consider quot;alteringquot; a Bogner, Diezel or the like.....
but it does work!.....

Fwiw..

Jeff Seal

oops, edit... the point was that even El34 based amps can be quot;tamed downquot;....(as can El84's...)


Originally Posted by CaptainCrunchSo in general, what can you tell me about EL84 based amps. I have a feel for EL34 vs. 6L6 but am pretty clueless on EL84's.

To get an idea sound wise of what an el84 amps sounds like go check out the komet constellation clips on are lots of clips of this 30 watt el84 amp which will probably blow you away, and you can even download clips of the el34 komet 60 watt head and compare them (theres even one clip which is the exact same track only done with each amp).

The amp is called the quot;constellationquot;...but beware, you may want to buy one really badly after listening to the clips! Don't laugh either, it happened to me...someone mentioned a komet a while ago so i had a listen to the clips and next thing i know probably a year later i had a komet rock up on my doorstep, and im in australia! I just had to have one!

I have a 6L6 Shiva and there is no other amp that touches it IMHO. I bought one a few years back and thought maybe I could find something that sounded as good but was a little easier on the back since these things are pretty heavy and I have a couple of blown discs in my back and the days of having a roadie are pretty much over for me, hehe. Anyway, long story short, I bought another one about 6 months ago and I am SET! On the subject of EL84 amps, I genrally don't like the sound and feel of EL84's but I had a Budda Superdrive 30 II before I bought my second Bogner and that was an incredible amp. I played that for like 3 years and loved every minute of it but I can't afford both and for me, the Bogner just does more of everything better. If I could afford it I would have my Bogner rig AND a Budda SD combo. That would absolutely rule! YMMV

Bump...i wanna see what you think of the constellation

Those EL84 shiva's go for at least a grand more, here is one on ebay. from : localhost/cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WDVW


Originally Posted by proxyThose EL84 shiva's go for at least a grand more, here is one on ebay. from : localhost/cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WDVW

At least a grand more than an EL34 or 6L6 combo? I see Shiva 1x12's go for $1600 so your saying $2499 is a good price? Since I've never seen one I just have no basis for comparison. Thanks.


Originally Posted by Young AngusBump...i wanna see what you think of the constellation

You scared me out of checking it out, I'm runnin' from that challenge Actually my sound card is screwed up so I'll have to wait until I'm at work and have some free time.


Originally Posted by Jeff SealI have the highest respect for Bogner's, but I will never own one....(since I make my own amps)

One of the easiest ways to effectively cut power output on these and any other amp is to reconfigure the rectifier so that the plates only see about half of the voltage they would normally see...(granted, I'm shooting myself in the foot by disclosing this...but better tone is better quot;sharedquot; than kept secret..) Most amps can be configured to give much lower output levels by simply reducing the plate voltage..... The dilemma.... most people would never even consider quot;alteringquot; a Bogner, Diezel or the like.....
but it does work!.....

Fwiw..

Jeff Seal

oops, edit... the point was that even El34 based amps can be quot;tamed downquot;....(as can El84's...)

Thanks for the input Jeff, much appreciated. Forgive the following perhaps naive questions, but I'm out of my depth here - so when this is done, is the fundamental tone or voicing of the amp altered, like I hear can happen with something like yellowjackets, or is the result just limited to effects of pure volume reduction?
And I assume the modification can be reversed? Thanks!

Dude...check out that constellation

Just bumping this thread. I can't find any info on these EL84 Shiva heads. A local store has one but they're listing it as a 50 watt - does anyone know if this is legit?

The Shiva according to all my knowledge (I did eventually buy mine which is 80W EL34) was never made in a EL84 model. My original post said EL84, but I meant EL34. I have owned mine now for about 2 years and it is an awesome amp. I love it. It is a very versatile amp. The cleans are reminiscent of a Fender Twin or Super Reverb, and the Drive is similar to a Marshall. It does not have the complexity of tone that a Plexi has but it has very much a Marshall flavor to it. The Midrange is a little too modern for my taste, but I have been able to dial in a good OD sound. These amps also take pedals very well. I don't use a lot of effects, but I have a Boss CE2, and DD3 running through the loop amp; a modded TS9 running straight in. I usually use the TS9 with the clean only, but every once in a while I run it in the dirty channel also.

If you are looking at a new one they have solved a few minor issues with the older model. The quot;Boostquot; control has a very small amount of volume increase. When I got mine I spoke to Bogner about it amp; they had a mod for it. I have not seen a new one, but have heard that on the back panel there is a volume control for each channel for the boost (??) The older ones also require a special cable for the effect loop. A friend made mine, but all it requires is a resistor to be soldered into it. Bogner has a detail description of how to make it on their website. The only problem I have had with mine the Reverb On/Off button on the foot pedal died. A simple fix. The Reverb is running into the power section as well so when you turn the reverb off the amp will get noticeably louder. I really like this amp a lot. I would say the one you are looking at is EL 34.

Not really sure why people are concerned about volume. The Shiva has 3 volume controls. One for each channel amp; a Master. They work really well at any volume. That said I play mine loud!


Originally Posted by marcg71Just bumping this thread. I can't find any info on these EL84 Shiva heads. A local store has one but they're listing it as a 50 watt - does anyone know if this is legit?

Well, after all these years, I've only seen them pop up a handful of times. Just play the thing and if it's priced right, you gotta go for it.

I've never heard of an EL-84 amp putting out 50 watts, it's probably either a typo or simply that the music store probably doesn't know jack when it comes to specs on things.

I didn't get the impression that you're worried about volume, but if you are, don't fret because Bogner has a way of creating really good master volume amplifiers. I jam on my EL-34 Shiva all the time at lower volumes and I love it (and that's 80 watts as opposed to the 15/30 watts that EL-84 version would be).

I contacted Bogner her is what they said.There are a few around, but we don't make them anymore. The front panel says SHIVA84.
Thanks,