software

installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each time I
setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such as Sum of
Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?

John T -

There may be some help, especially if you tell us which of the three ANOVA
tools you want to use, how you have the data organized, and the specific
error message. The setup is different for each of the three ANOVA tests.
And, the Microsoft web site has some Knowledge Base articles about Excel
2000 ANOVA, but maybe you've already looked at those.

- Mike
www.mikemiddleton.com

quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
...
gt; installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each time I
gt; setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such as Sum of
gt; Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?
Specifically, I want to do repeated ANOVAS and two-way ANOVAS. The data pack
says I can do both.

On the repeated ANOVA, I have 10 subjects, with three tiers (K): base score,
immediate score after experience, and six months later. I know that the
results will be faulty, if I do a series of repeated t tests, and compare,
because I need the quot;errorquot; interaction.

The other is a simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.

In either case, my calculations seem to be off, and I need to verify them.
(twoo hours worth, ugh!)

quot;Mike Middletonquot; wrote:

gt; John T -
gt;
gt; There may be some help, especially if you tell us which of the three ANOVA
gt; tools you want to use, how you have the data organized, and the specific
gt; error message. The setup is different for each of the three ANOVA tests.
gt; And, the Microsoft web site has some Knowledge Base articles about Excel
gt; 2000 ANOVA, but maybe you've already looked at those.
gt;
gt; - Mike
gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt;
gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt; ...
gt; gt; installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each time I
gt; gt; setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such as Sum of
gt; gt; Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?
gt;
gt;
gt;

John T -

For the repeated measures ANOVA, you could use quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor Without
Replicationquot; of Excel's Analysis ToolPak.

For example, you could arrange your data with subject names in A2:A11;
labels quot;base,quot; quot;after,quot; and quot;laterquot; in B11; and scores in B211. Choose
Tools | Data Analysis | Anova: Two-Factor Without Replication, enter A111
for Input Range, check the Labels box, specify Alpha, choose a location for
the output, and click OK. On the output, ignore the Rows variation, and
focus on the Columns variation.

You didn't describe your data for the quot;simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.quot; To use
Excel's quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor With Replication,quot; you must have the same number
of observations for each of the six combinations of factors. Excel's tool
cannot handle unequal sample sizes.

- Mike
www.mikemiddleton.com

quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
news
gt; Specifically, I want to do repeated ANOVAS and two-way ANOVAS. The data
gt; pack
gt; says I can do both.
gt;
gt; On the repeated ANOVA, I have 10 subjects, with three tiers (K): base
gt; score,
gt; immediate score after experience, and six months later. I know that the
gt; results will be faulty, if I do a series of repeated t tests, and
gt; compare,
gt; because I need the quot;errorquot; interaction.
gt;
gt; The other is a simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.
gt;
gt; In either case, my calculations seem to be off, and I need to verify them.
gt; (twoo hours worth, ugh!)
gt;
gt; quot;Mike Middletonquot; wrote:
gt;
gt;gt; John T -
gt;gt;
gt;gt; There may be some help, especially if you tell us which of the three
gt;gt; ANOVA
gt;gt; tools you want to use, how you have the data organized, and the specific
gt;gt; error message. The setup is different for each of the three ANOVA tests.
gt;gt; And, the Microsoft web site has some Knowledge Base articles about Excel
gt;gt; 2000 ANOVA, but maybe you've already looked at those.
gt;gt;
gt;gt; - Mike
gt;gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt;gt;
gt;gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt;gt; ...
gt;gt; gt; installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each time I
gt;gt; gt; setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such as Sum
gt;gt; gt; of
gt;gt; gt; Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?
gt;gt;
gt;gt;
gt;gt;
Thanks Mike:

I will print it and try it tomorrow. I am too tired from doing manual
calculations to fool around further.

quot;Michael R Middletonquot; wrote:

gt; John T -
gt;
gt; For the repeated measures ANOVA, you could use quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor Without
gt; Replicationquot; of Excel's Analysis ToolPak.
gt;
gt; For example, you could arrange your data with subject names in A2:A11;
gt; labels quot;base,quot; quot;after,quot; and quot;laterquot; in B11; and scores in B211. Choose
gt; Tools | Data Analysis | Anova: Two-Factor Without Replication, enter A111
gt; for Input Range, check the Labels box, specify Alpha, choose a location for
gt; the output, and click OK. On the output, ignore the Rows variation, and
gt; focus on the Columns variation.
gt;
gt; You didn't describe your data for the quot;simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.quot; To use
gt; Excel's quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor With Replication,quot; you must have the same number
gt; of observations for each of the six combinations of factors. Excel's tool
gt; cannot handle unequal sample sizes.
gt;
gt; - Mike
gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt;
gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt; news
gt; gt; Specifically, I want to do repeated ANOVAS and two-way ANOVAS. The data
gt; gt; pack
gt; gt; says I can do both.
gt; gt;
gt; gt; On the repeated ANOVA, I have 10 subjects, with three tiers (K): base
gt; gt; score,
gt; gt; immediate score after experience, and six months later. I know that the
gt; gt; results will be faulty, if I do a series of repeated t tests, and
gt; gt; compare,
gt; gt; because I need the quot;errorquot; interaction.
gt; gt;
gt; gt; The other is a simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.
gt; gt;
gt; gt; In either case, my calculations seem to be off, and I need to verify them.
gt; gt; (twoo hours worth, ugh!)
gt; gt;
gt; gt; quot;Mike Middletonquot; wrote:
gt; gt;
gt; gt;gt; John T -
gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt;gt; There may be some help, especially if you tell us which of the three
gt; gt;gt; ANOVA
gt; gt;gt; tools you want to use, how you have the data organized, and the specific
gt; gt;gt; error message. The setup is different for each of the three ANOVA tests.
gt; gt;gt; And, the Microsoft web site has some Knowledge Base articles about Excel
gt; gt;gt; 2000 ANOVA, but maybe you've already looked at those.
gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt;gt; - Mike
gt; gt;gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt;gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt; gt;gt; ...
gt; gt;gt; gt; installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each time I
gt; gt;gt; gt; setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such as Sum
gt; gt;gt; gt; of
gt; gt;gt; gt; Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?
gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt;gt;
gt;
gt;
gt;

Mike:

Your explanation hepled greatly, but I did run into a major problem.
I explained it in another post lost in cyberspace. Here it is in a nutshell:

The SS of each, between, subject, error and total were consiferably
different from the ones I calculated 3X for verification. (The column sums of
mean, square and total were correct, but that is where it ended.) Naturally,
the F ratio was off, showing a significant difference when there was none.

I need to use that function because my version of SPSS does not have it. Am
I asking too much of Excel?

quot;John Tquot; wrote:

gt; Thanks Mike:
gt;
gt; I will print it and try it tomorrow. I am too tired from doing manual
gt; calculations to fool around further.
gt;
gt; quot;Michael R Middletonquot; wrote:
gt;
gt; gt; John T -
gt; gt;
gt; gt; For the repeated measures ANOVA, you could use quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor Without
gt; gt; Replicationquot; of Excel's Analysis ToolPak.
gt; gt;
gt; gt; For example, you could arrange your data with subject names in A2:A11;
gt; gt; labels quot;base,quot; quot;after,quot; and quot;laterquot; in B11; and scores in B211. Choose
gt; gt; Tools | Data Analysis | Anova: Two-Factor Without Replication, enter A111
gt; gt; for Input Range, check the Labels box, specify Alpha, choose a location for
gt; gt; the output, and click OK. On the output, ignore the Rows variation, and
gt; gt; focus on the Columns variation.
gt; gt;
gt; gt; You didn't describe your data for the quot;simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.quot; To use
gt; gt; Excel's quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor With Replication,quot; you must have the same number
gt; gt; of observations for each of the six combinations of factors. Excel's tool
gt; gt; cannot handle unequal sample sizes.
gt; gt;
gt; gt; - Mike
gt; gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt; gt;
gt; gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt; gt; news
gt; gt; gt; Specifically, I want to do repeated ANOVAS and two-way ANOVAS. The data
gt; gt; gt; pack
gt; gt; gt; says I can do both.
gt; gt; gt;
gt; gt; gt; On the repeated ANOVA, I have 10 subjects, with three tiers (K): base
gt; gt; gt; score,
gt; gt; gt; immediate score after experience, and six months later. I know that the
gt; gt; gt; results will be faulty, if I do a series of repeated t tests, and
gt; gt; gt; compare,
gt; gt; gt; because I need the quot;errorquot; interaction.
gt; gt; gt;
gt; gt; gt; The other is a simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.
gt; gt; gt;
gt; gt; gt; In either case, my calculations seem to be off, and I need to verify them.
gt; gt; gt; (twoo hours worth, ugh!)
gt; gt; gt;
gt; gt; gt; quot;Mike Middletonquot; wrote:
gt; gt; gt;
gt; gt; gt;gt; John T -
gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt; gt;gt; There may be some help, especially if you tell us which of the three
gt; gt; gt;gt; ANOVA
gt; gt; gt;gt; tools you want to use, how you have the data organized, and the specific
gt; gt; gt;gt; error message. The setup is different for each of the three ANOVA tests.
gt; gt; gt;gt; And, the Microsoft web site has some Knowledge Base articles about Excel
gt; gt; gt;gt; 2000 ANOVA, but maybe you've already looked at those.
gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt; gt;gt; - Mike
gt; gt; gt;gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt; gt;gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt; gt; gt;gt; ...
gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each time I
gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such as Sum
gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; of
gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?
gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt; gt;
gt; gt;
gt; gt;

John T -

I do not have your data, and I do not know what calculations you did for
your verification.

An example of repeated measures ANOVA is available at

psynts.dur.ac.uk/notes/Year2/...suresANOVA.htm

When I use Excel's quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor Without Replicationquot; with the data of
that example, the Excel result for Columns variation is F = 10, identical to
SPSS's General Linear Model (the table of quot;Tests of Within-Subjects Effectsquot;
of the web site example).

- Mike

quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
...
gt; Mike:
gt;
gt; Your explanation hepled greatly, but I did run into a major problem.
gt; I explained it in another post lost in cyberspace. Here it is in a
gt; nutshell:
gt;
gt; The SS of each, between, subject, error and total were consiferably
gt; different from the ones I calculated 3X for verification. (The column sums
gt; of
gt; mean, square and total were correct, but that is where it ended.)
gt; Naturally,
gt; the F ratio was off, showing a significant difference when there was none.
gt;
gt; I need to use that function because my version of SPSS does not have it.
gt; Am
gt; I asking too much of Excel?
gt;
gt; quot;John Tquot; wrote:
gt;
gt;gt; Thanks Mike:
gt;gt;
gt;gt; I will print it and try it tomorrow. I am too tired from doing manual
gt;gt; calculations to fool around further.
gt;gt;
gt;gt; quot;Michael R Middletonquot; wrote:
gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt; John T -
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; For the repeated measures ANOVA, you could use quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor
gt;gt; gt; Without
gt;gt; gt; Replicationquot; of Excel's Analysis ToolPak.
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; For example, you could arrange your data with subject names in A2:A11;
gt;gt; gt; labels quot;base,quot; quot;after,quot; and quot;laterquot; in B11; and scores in B211.
gt;gt; gt; Choose
gt;gt; gt; Tools | Data Analysis | Anova: Two-Factor Without Replication, enter
gt;gt; gt; A111
gt;gt; gt; for Input Range, check the Labels box, specify Alpha, choose a location
gt;gt; gt; for
gt;gt; gt; the output, and click OK. On the output, ignore the Rows variation, and
gt;gt; gt; focus on the Columns variation.
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; You didn't describe your data for the quot;simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.quot; To
gt;gt; gt; use
gt;gt; gt; Excel's quot;ANOVA: Two-Factor With Replication,quot; you must have the same
gt;gt; gt; number
gt;gt; gt; of observations for each of the six combinations of factors. Excel's
gt;gt; gt; tool
gt;gt; gt; cannot handle unequal sample sizes.
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; - Mike
gt;gt; gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt;gt; gt; news
gt;gt; gt; gt; Specifically, I want to do repeated ANOVAS and two-way ANOVAS. The
gt;gt; gt; gt; data
gt;gt; gt; gt; pack
gt;gt; gt; gt; says I can do both.
gt;gt; gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt; On the repeated ANOVA, I have 10 subjects, with three tiers (K): base
gt;gt; gt; gt; score,
gt;gt; gt; gt; immediate score after experience, and six months later. I know that
gt;gt; gt; gt; the
gt;gt; gt; gt; results will be faulty, if I do a series of repeated t tests, and
gt;gt; gt; gt; compare,
gt;gt; gt; gt; because I need the quot;errorquot; interaction.
gt;gt; gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt; The other is a simple 2X3 two-way ANOVA.
gt;gt; gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt; In either case, my calculations seem to be off, and I need to verify
gt;gt; gt; gt; them.
gt;gt; gt; gt; (twoo hours worth, ugh!)
gt;gt; gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt; quot;Mike Middletonquot; wrote:
gt;gt; gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; John T -
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; There may be some help, especially if you tell us which of the three
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; ANOVA
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; tools you want to use, how you have the data organized, and the
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; specific
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; error message. The setup is different for each of the three ANOVA
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; tests.
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; And, the Microsoft web site has some Knowledge Base articles about
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; Excel
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; 2000 ANOVA, but maybe you've already looked at those.
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; - Mike
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; www.mikemiddleton.com
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; quot;John Tquot; gt; wrote in message
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; ...
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; installed the data pack, and it says that I can do ANOVAs. Each
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; time I
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; setup the data, I can not get any data out of the analysisI such
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; as Sum
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; of
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt; gt; Squares, df, F ratio etc. I get error messages. Any help for me?
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt; gt;gt;
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt;
gt;gt; gt;