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Guys like The Edge or Tom Morello. People who's signature tone involves a pedal, who possibly wouldn't be recognized by their rhythm guitar tone. They're often hailed as guitar heroes, but I'm not sure. Everybody cracks on Kirk Hammett for leaning so heavily on a wah, but leaves a lot of the quot;pedalquot; guys alone. So, what does everybody think? Should you have to be able to hold your own with a guitar straight into an amp to be considered a guitar hero?

I think so, most definately.

That said, Chuck's signature sound, IMO, was his chorus laiden leads.

Do you concider Distortion an effect? I would!

True . . . I would definitly agree on some level's and disagree on others. Take away edge's delay rigs, and well, he wouldnt sound like the edge, however take away srv's, evh's (more brownsound era vh), or other more quot;hands onquot; guitar players, and inherently, no matter what guitar they played, through any amp, they would still sound like them. I guess there's no quot;right or wrongquot; just personal preference. I know for myself, I dont want to be dependent on a certain pedal, because what if Im watching a friends band live at a bar one night, my friend calls me up to jam with him for a bit, i dont have my guitar, my pedals, or my amp, all I have is my hands. But I guess for guy's like Edge and Morello, thats what they prefer, and well Id say its working for them too . . . I'd chalk it up to what kind of guitar player you want to come out of the side being . . .


Originally Posted by GandLManTrue . . . I would definitly agree on some level's and disagree on others. Take away edge's delay rigs, and well, he wouldnt sound like the edge, however take away srv's, evh's (more brownsound era vh), or other more quot;hands onquot; guitar players, and inherently, no matter what guitar they played, through any amp, they would still sound like them. I guess there's no quot;right or wrongquot; just personal preference. I know for myself, I dont want to be dependent on a certain pedal, because what if Im watching a friends band live at a bar one night, my friend calls me up to jam with him for a bit, i dont have my guitar, my pedals, or my amp, all I have is my hands. But I guess for guy's like Edge and Morello, thats what they prefer, and well Id say its working for them too . . . I'd chalk it up to what kind of guitar player you want to come out of the side being . . .

Agreed. The effects guys have carved out a niche for themselves (I would add Andy Summers to that list) and I don't blame them for it. Who knows, they may have successfully done what I have been trying to do for 25 years, and that is to find a couple or three tones that I love so that I can stick with them.

I think players who can use effects effectively (hehe) are really talented if they are using them in more than 2/3 of their playing. Justifying the use of excessive effects is extremely hard in most cases and it takes a certain type of guitar geek to make full use of the sonic colours they can paint with. Most of us just end up using reverbs and delays to enhance leads and putting on some chorus to enhance some cleans.

I use chorus and compression all the time and vary amounts of delay and distortion. It doesn't give me any sort of recognizeable tone, but I like the way it sounds, which in turn, inspires my playing.


Originally Posted by JB_From_HellGuys like The Edge or Tom Morello. People who's signature tone involves a pedal, who possibly wouldn't be recognized by their rhythm guitar tone. They're often hailed as guitar heroes, but I'm not sure. Everybody cracks on Kirk Hammett for leaning so heavily on a wah, but leaves a lot of the quot;pedalquot; guys alone. So, what does everybody think? Should you have to be able to hold your own with a guitar straight into an amp to be considered a guitar hero?

Dude, this is Rock and Roll and THERE ARE NO RULES!!!

I think a guy like the Edge is called guitar hero because he brought something new to the game. He has a signature style as well as his own sound and when he plays you know it's him . Does'nt matter to me if it's a guy who has guitar-cord-amp or a guy like the Edge who uses effects to carve his sound. The bottom line is someone like the Edge has his own thing going and used what he needed to get there. And he does it well.


Originally Posted by Mike M.I think a guy like the Edge is called guitar hero because he brought something new to the game. He has a signature style as well as his own sound and when he plays you know it's him . Does'nt matter to me if it's a guy who has guitar-cord-amp or a guy like the Edge who uses effects to carve his sound. The bottom line is someone like the Edge has his own thing going and used what he needed to get there. And he does it well.

1 I couldn't have said it better.

Robert Fripp, Adrian Belew, and David Torn use tons of effects, but are hellish players at the same time. All 3 have areas of electric playing that they *invented*, so to me, it doesn't matter how they got there.


Originally Posted by MincerRobert Fripp, Adrian Belew, and David Torn use tons of effects, but are hellish players at the same time. All 3 have areas of electric playing that they *invented*, so to me, it doesn't matter how they got there.

Add David Gilmour to that list.

Matt Bellamy - he has wierd effects pedals BUILT INTO his custom guitars Still one ruddy cool player tho.

If you can make a guitar sound cool and musical, thats all that matters. Doesnt matter how you get there, those people are quot;herosquot; because people hear them and like what they hear. People who dont play guitar never say quot;I bet he couldnt play a lick without his distortion, reverb, chorus and delayquot; or could you see a bunch of drunk chicks in a bar sitting around the table chatting.....quot;I cant beleive that guy plays root/fifth power chords all the timequot;.....quot;yeah, he sucksquot; This frame of mind comes only from people who play and perhaps may be a little jealous of the quot;herosquot;....I still love you though BoJangles!

You must not listen much to either of the guys you just named.

Tom Morello's rhythm tone is very recognizable. I could tell him and a copy from a mile away.

I think Tom Morello is far from dependent on The Whammy. Morello would still be a great guitar player without the Whammy, but he'd be far less interesting and most likely way too run-of-the-mill. There's something about his choice of strings (9's I believe), guitars, the fact that he's never changed tubes in his amp, and just the way he uses his hands all in conjunction with The Whammy that makes his tone so defining. Nobody sounds like Tom Morello but Tom Morello.

The same goes for The Edge. Much of what made the The Edge quot;The Edgequot; on albums like The Joshua Tree and War is almost not present on How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb but he still sounds like quot;The Edgequot;.

If you listen to either of those players very closely you'll hear what I mean. There's just a certain way they play that the pedal only accentuates.

Now, this being said, if Morello didn't have the Whammy produced broken engine sounds and The Edge didn't have the delay drenched crystalline clean tone they wouldn't quite be the same players. I think it's the fact that they didn't go the route of every other guitarist and rely on guitar amp pentatonic scale or old blues licks, while paying quot;Tributequot; to Paige or Clapton (or some other defining guitar hero) that makes them standout so much (in a good way) and the fact that they're doing it a way nobody quite thought of that makes them so defining. Of course I'm over-generalizing but it's really hard to have your own voice when guys like Jimmy Page (who had a wah to go above John in the early days), Eddie Van Halen (who of course used the Phase 90 on Van Halen for rhythm tracks/solos quite a bit), and Eric Clapton (who also used a crap-load of wah on the godly Disraeli Gears album) have pretty much set an quot;unreachablequot; standard for rock guitar...


Originally Posted by DeadSkinSlayer3I think so, most definately.

That said, Chuck's signature sound, IMO, was his chorus laiden leads.

I always thought Chuck Schuldiner's solos were pretty boring and his lead tone sucked IMO.
His signature sound was his badass riffing and vocals. Using effects and using effects in a musical way are two totally different things. Listen to someone like Adrian Belew to hear what i mean.


Originally Posted by Closed EyeTom Morello's rhythm tone is very recognizable. I could tell him and a copy from a mile away.

I think Tom Morello is far from dependent on The Whammy. Morello would still be a great guitar player without the Whammy, but he'd be far less interesting and most likely way too run-of-the-mill. There's something about his choice of strings (9's I believe), guitars, the fact that he's never changed tubes in his amp, and just the way he uses his hands all in conjunction with The Whammy that makes his tone so defining. Nobody sounds like Tom Morello but Tom Morello.

So true. There are too many people who look down on Rage that haven't heard their self-titled album all the way through. Tom's rhythm tone is very cool and recognizable. I think someone else said it on this forum, and I agree, Tom opened my eyes to single-coil neck pickup rhythm tone. For a song without effects, check out Take the Power Back. There's a great solo on that song as well as Settle For Nothing.


Originally Posted by Closed EyeTom Morello's rhythm tone is very recognizable. I could tell him and a copy from a mile away.

I think Tom Morello is far from dependent on The Whammy. Morello would still be a great guitar player without the Whammy, but he'd be far less interesting and most likely way too run-of-the-mill. There's something about his choice of strings (9's I believe), guitars, the fact that he's never changed tubes in his amp, and just the way he uses his hands all in conjunction with The Whammy that makes his tone so defining. Nobody sounds like Tom Morello but Tom Morello.

Couldn't have said it better myself. To hear Morello solo with NO pitch bending effects listen to:

Darkness (of of their quot;Live and Rarequot; album)
Settle for Nothing
Freedom (has a slight delay).

Morello is a very competent guitarist without any pedals.

On topic of the original question, in my opinion, it doesnt matter how you get your tone, the point is that you get it.

EDIT: Also forgot to mention, although he does use the ^5th on his whammy during the solo to this song, listen to how he plays in the solo for quot;Know Your Enemyquot;.

I'm kinda weird on this issue. I started out guitargt;cordgt;amp. Then I found distortion and it went guitargt;pedalgt;amp.

Then I got my Z. I went back to guitargt;cordgt;amp. It broke up on its own but only when my ears were starting to bleed and I wanted more. I then went back to using my SD-1. From there I went to my SD booster pedal and until about a month ago I used my booster only.

Funny thing happened. I was over at my friend's house (my bassist) and he says, hey instead of using only that dual OD with the champ (BF) lets use the BP8 (tube preamp bass effects pedal) as a noisegate. Then this led to that and before I knew it I had some light reverb and flange on it. I loved what I heard Stratgt;ODgt;BP8gt;champ. Then he let me take it home and I hooked it up to my Z when I went home. The presets were different so I added some slight compression and EQ. Now I use the preamp for overdrive and my Booster pedal ONLY for solos.

I took the setup down to the other guys I play with, It sounded great in the mix and everyone liked the sound.

So to make a long story short, I haven't ever busted anybody's chops for using effects.

Luke


Originally Posted by BornToShredI always thought Chuck Schuldiner's solos were pretty boring and his lead tone sucked IMO.
His signature sound was his badass riffing and vocals. Using effects and using effects in a musical way are two totally different things. Listen to someone like Adrian Belew to hear what i mean.

Tone is a matter of taste too! Chuck used a lot of Reverb not chorus. That is why it sounded over the top. Too much reverb sounds like crap! Though too much of anything sounds like crap!