software

hey i just rewired my guitar that only has 2 pots... i changed it from 1 vol 1 tone to, just plain.. 2 volumes!

one for the neck pickup, one for the bridge (both humbuckers)

all works fine cept when i have the switch in the middle position, then both volume knobs effect each pickup.... this isnt supposed to happen is it?

Example: switch in bridge pos-only the top volume knob effects it, the other does nothing, switch in neck pos-only the bottom volume knob effects it, the other does nothing to it.....

but when i have switch in middle, turning the top volume knob down all the way while leaving the bottom volume knob up all the way makes both pickups close to silent, and vice versa with top/bottom knobsi wired it exactly like youd wire a lespaul, just, without tone pots (meaning no capacitors) so if you need a schematic, look at the SD schematics on the site or something.

is it supposed to do this? I rewired it like this hoping that i could put the switch in middle position, and have the neck pickup at full volume while having the bridge pickups volume rolled down alot to try and get a somewhat unique sound... but if i turn down the bridges volume, the necks volume goes too............

help! ahhhhhhhh


Originally Posted by Gugnirall works fine cept when i have the switch in the middle position, then both volume knobs effect each pickup.... this isnt supposed to happen is it?

Yes it is. Its why I never use more than one volume control. There is a way around it, but it isn't ideal either. Reverse the center lug and the end opposite the end thats grounded. Its a little better, still not ideal.

wow thats incredibly lame, so all those high price gibson les pauls that have 2 vol 2 tone... have this same thing happen when the switch is in mid position??????

Hey Artie I'm going to do a 3 Vol - 3Tone config with my Strat... (by using concentric pots).. will I have the same problems? If yes, how can I get around?

Btw.. you postet me a schem with three volume pots.. would that have those problems too?

thanks


Originally Posted by Gugnirwow thats incredibly lame, so all those high price gibson les pauls that have 2 vol 2 tone... have this same thing happen when the switch is in mid position??????

Yes. But remember, there's a million LP owners out there that it doesn't bother. It just bothers me . . . and perhaps, you too. Originally Posted by KommerzbassistHey Artie I'm going to do a 3 Vol - 3Tone config with my Strat... (by using concentric pots).. will I have the same problems? If yes, how can I get around?

Btw.. you postet me a schem with three volume pots.. would that have those problems too?

thanks

Yes, you'll have those same quot;problemsquot; too. Let me just say, that I have my own personal biases against multiple volume controls in a guitar. As I stated above, a million other folks don't. So take all this with a grain of salt.

Multiple volume controls on a guitar try to emulate a mixer, which just can't be done effectively in a passive circuit. There is a way around it . . . sorta.
Look at this diagram:Fig. 1 shows the standard LP way of doing two volumes. As you can see, when either volume is at zero, the output is grounded - ergo, no volume.
Fig. 2 shows one way around it. Reverse the center and end lug. Now one volume won't kill the other, but you lower the effective quot;loadquot; on the pup as you lower the volume, killing some of the high end.

Basically, thats it in a nutshell. I have a couple of ideas on how to beat both of these problems, but I don't own a dual-volume control guitar yet to experiment on.

Hopefully, soon.

Please share your ideas I'd be really interested

Or.. couldn't I just put a diode in to seperate the signals somehow and make a one way pass to the 5-way?

Ah and another thing... does.. in th efirst scheme... the volumes only effect each other if one is down at 0 or always?

yea i dont wanna kill any of my high end, i play extreme metal ya know.. black and death metal...... high end is everything for me lol...

but remember artie im still using those livewire active pickups (remember you posted on my other forum post about that hum problem i get)

so it affects actives too not just passives..... i just dont under stand how the bottom volume knob ONLY EFFECTS the bridge pickup when the switch is in mid position.....

if i have switch in bridge pos, the bottom volume knob, doesnt do a dman thing to the sound, i turn it all the way down and it sounds the same as it does all the way up.... thats because its only connected to the neck pickup......

so why does it then intercept the bridge circuit when i set the switch to read both pup signals.....??? the 2 pots are going to 2 different sides of the switch.... hmm

the pup signal goes into the pot, the pot processes it, then sends it to the switch, switch sends to output jack... so how does the neck pot proccess the bridge signal when switch is receiving both pots.... i dont get it

That's easy to explain... just because when you're at the bridge, the connection to th eneck control is cut physically by the Pup selector switch...
Originally Posted by Gugnirthe pup signal goes into the pot, the pot processes it, then sends it to the switch, switch sends to output jack... so how does the neck pot proccess the bridge signal when switch is receiving both pots.... i dont get it

Would be nice but electric current doesn't think like you... if it finds a way to go to ground, it will...

yea i know, thats how it should be, and thats how it is......

but when i put the switch to use both pickups, the neck volume control silences both pickups...... and the bridge volume control silences both pickups.....

when switch in bridge position - neck vol does nothing, bridge vol does what it should
when switch in neck position - bridge vol does nothing, neck vol does what it should
when switch in middle position - both volumes do what only one should, 1 volume will silence both pickups

its like the neck pot grounds the bridge pups signal when i turn the neck volume down, and/or vice versa for bridge...... if you know what i mean

Yes this is basically because it's exactly the way you decribed it with the last sentence.

why dont you try pulling the switch out of the circuit? if youve got both Vpots attached to the mmiddle of the switch one pot will turn both down. take the pot out so both pickups are just always on and you can control them individually for your unique sound

i dont have both pots connected to the middle of the switch, theyre each connected to their corresponding sides of the switch, the middle of the switch connects to the output jack

how is it grounding it tho, nothing of the neck volume connects to the bridge volume............

there only similarity is that they both touch the switch..... its grounding it thru the switch?

the bridge pot signal goes thru the switch into the neck pot then back to the switch in order to go thru the output?

thats the only way the neck pot can ground the bridge pots signal... if im not mistaken.

damn electricity, i hate it lol


Originally Posted by Gugnirthe bridge pot signal goes thru the switch into the neck pot then back to the switch in order to go thru the output?

No... as you may have noticed, it doesn't go back anymore

btw i dont have this problems with either of my les pauls


Originally Posted by h8red442btw i dont have this problems with either of my les pauls

They are fakes :fing25:

havent even been a member for 24 hours and already someone's starting

so youve tried setting your LP's to have the switch in the middle position..... keep the neck volume at max, but the bridge volume at 0, and your neck pup still gives its full sound??

im going to bed now, ill check this post when i wake up... thanks for all the help guys i appreciate it, later


Originally Posted by KommerzbassistPlease share your ideas I'd be really interested

Or.. couldn't I just put a diode in to seperate the signals somehow and make a one way pass to the 5-way?

Tell you what, I'll post my ideas in another post, and others can try it before I do. Don't use a diode. Originally Posted by KommerzbassistAh and another thing... does.. in th efirst scheme... the volumes only effect each other if one is down at 0 or always?

Exactly. Fig. 1 and Fig. 2 are electrically identical when on quot;10quot;. The problem only becomes apparent as you turn the volume down.Originally Posted by Gugnirso it affects actives too not just passives.....

Yes, the fundamental problem is the same with passives or actives.Originally Posted by Gugnirso why does it then intercept the bridge circuit when i set the switch to read both pup signals.....??? the 2 pots are going to 2 different sides of the switch.... hmm

the pup signal goes into the pot, the pot processes it, then sends it to the switch, switch sends to output jack... so how does the neck pot proccess the bridge signal when switch is receiving both pots.... i dont get it

Well, there's no quot;processingquot; per se. These are all passive, or quot;dumbquot; components. The electricity doesn't know that its not supposed to go through the switch in the other direction. A switch is just a mechanical short.

Look at this diagram:Its the exact same thing as above, only now, I'm showing the switch. Here's the same drawing with one volume control on quot;10quot;, and one on zero:Notice how the output jack is shorted to ground through the bottom control. There's no way around that. That what active mixers do. They use electronics to isolate one channel from another. Hard to do with passive components. (Which is different than active pickups.)

Hope all this makes some sense.


Originally Posted by ArtieTooExactly. Fig. 1 and Fig. 2 are electrically identical when on quot;10quot;. The problem only becomes apparent as you turn the volume down.

No, I mean do they affect each other if one's at 0, or also one's for example at 5 and the other at 10?

h8red442, that was just a joke man, nothing serious k?