software

What do you think guys? ( i would like GearJoneser to comment on this if he can, i respect your opinion)

from my experience, i would have done much better if i had a low budget to get a good SS amp then a cheap tube amp.
i think that cheap tube amps sound horrible compared to a good SS amp and still cost more.

I dont know if you have had this experience. I remember my friend had an old SS marshall ( not the valvestate crap) that was made at the time of the JCM800. Sounded better than my JTM60 and of course cause it was SS was waaaaaaaaaaayyy more reliable and waaaay cheaper.

Just my opinion that bad tube amps sound pretty horrble compared to good SS amps.

Im not talking sheer price cause sometimes you can find great deals on good tube amps.

Just to prove it , have you heard that guy that playes Halen through a cheap Crate??!!! Pretty darn good if i dont say so myself.

A good amp is a good amp. An amp that doesn't sound good ain't worth the money regardless of price or construction.

You probably don't quot;respect my opnionquot; - but I play a cheap Crate and I am very happy with it. I am sure a good tube amp would sound better... but I think your assessment is probably very good..

Rick

I am a big fan of getting used, the buck goes MUCH further. You get much more guitar or amp for the money. In reality I've only heard one quot;badquot; tube amp, an epi electar. It sounded too plasticy, I think the crates, hot rods series, and peavey classic series all have their place.

Luke

Well... i think you could compare a cheap, poor tube amp to a cheap, poor Bentley\Rolls Royce, and a good SS amp to an expensive, luxurious BMW\Merchedes .

In this excample, the Rolls Royce, or tube amp, is the best..... oh, damn, forget it, i f'ed up the comparison.

My uncle has a 80's Marshall JCM800 Super Lead 5010, it's all SS and it's the best amp i've ever played. And i've played some tube amps too, crates for excample, who really sucked.

To me, it doesn't care if an amp has tubes, it's gotta sound good. So, i'd get a good SS amp instead of a cheap tube amp.

If i could have my pick though, i'd have a good tube amp!

Cheers,
-Erlend

ive heard too many bad sounding tube amps to discredit a comparison...figure out your budget, buy used, and listen...who cares how it gets its sound. The sound itself is important.

what i am getting at is that i think there are ALOT of companies out there that just think that by putting tubes in the amp it will sell. they forget that when cutting out costs here and there, there is a huge impact on the sound.

they forget all the other links in the chain.

a tube amp needs more quality parts and design i think to sound good then a SS amp.

So if ya aint gonna do it right dont do it at all.

i totally agree that a SS crate can sound great.


Originally Posted by tone?a tube amp needs more quality parts and design i think to sound good then a SS amp.

I really disagree with you on this issue.
First, for 90-something percent of players tube amp tones (clean or OD) are the benchmark. What that really means is that a SS amp designer needs to come up with a circuit that somehow sounds like a tube circuit despite solid state's more abrupt distortion and general lack of sag. Where a tube amp designer can pull out an RCA circuit out of a book and have a Fendery amp, the SS amp designer is fighting the nature of his components to get a comparable tone.
The one area where the tube amp builder really can't afford to economize is the transformers. Other than that, resistors, chokes, and capacitors are going to have the same effect in either SS or tube amps. The tube amp builder has one advantage over the SS amp builder in term of component quality. Since it's relatively easy to swap out tubes, especially preamp tubes, the tube amp builder can use cheapo tubes that will be upgraded by the owner. It's a lot harder to upgrade op-amps and power transistors in a SS amp.

Save your money and buy a decent tube amp - you can get a really decent used for between $600-$1000 and new at about the same start price but you can go as high as $3,000 . I have a Mesa Boogie Mark IV that I bought for $1600 new - you can find them used on Ebay for about $800-900 it is an incredible, versatile amp.

Just my $.02


Originally Posted by Erlend_GWell... i think you could compare a cheap, poor tube amp to a cheap, poor Bentley\Rolls Royce, and a good SS amp to an expensive, luxurious BMW\Merchedes .

In this excample, the Rolls Royce, or tube amp, is the best..... oh, damn, forget it, i f'ed up the comparison.

My uncle has a 80's Marshall JCM800 Super Lead 5010, it's all SS and it's the best amp i've ever played. And i've played some tube amps too, crates for excample, who really sucked.

To me, it doesn't care if an amp has tubes, it's gotta sound good. So, i'd get a good SS amp instead of a cheap tube amp.

If i could have my pick though, i'd have a good tube amp!

Cheers,
-Erlenddude i think jcm800 are tube amps !!!!!!!!! arent they??

Hummm-
I have among my amps, a very cheap all tube class A Crate VC 20, sure, when I got it, it sounded like crap, but with some tube and speaker upgrades, it has turned into a great little screamer. I've had people offer to buy it for alot of money. Tone for days, and will keep up with almost any other amp. I also have a Marshall JCM602, which alot of people pan, but I'm crazy about it. Keep in mind that I have experimented with ALOT of tube and speaker combinations, but, it also screams. I guess what I'm saying is, if you work with whatever amp you have, you can make a true tone machine. It just takes patience and experimentation to find what you are looking for.

quot;It's a shoddy workman indeed, that blames his tools!quot; The Rev. Billy G

They're called valves V.A.L.V.E.S


Originally Posted by LambofGoddude i think jcm800 are tube amps !!!!!!!!! arent they??

Well, in the 80's there were a few quot;transistorizedquot; JCM800's, including the 5010

yeah , my friend had a transistorized version of the JCM800 in a combo that sounded great.
way better than lots of tube amps that i have heard and way better than the newer Marshall DSL, TSL crap ou there.

all these answers and no one asked....what do you consider cheap?

-Mike

Those old Marshall SS amps from the mid 80's (lead 12, 5X series), sound very good. I had a few myself, and still wish I did. Most SS stuff and modeling gear jes sounds awful to me...not all of it...but most of it.

I find like anything you get what ya pay for tho....A cheap amp is a cheap amp..whether it's a Tube amp or a SS amp. There are a FEW exceptional lower cost tube amps that are excellent with a tube/speaker upgrade (e.g.Peavey C30, Crate V series, Traynors)..but they are the exception...not the rule.

That said, I don't think there are many really good SS amps on the market either right now because the technology has gone to modeling and true SS circuits have once again been put at the back of the line and ignored. And quite frankly, I'd rather have a good SS amp, than any digital modeler.

I would look for one of those old Marshall 800 5X series/lead 12 amps..I've been eyeing them on EBAY for quite some time..jes have not pulled the trigger....YET.

Here's a couple good ones:
Lead 100 MOSFET
Combo
LEAD 12


Originally Posted by APB_4They're called valves V.A.L.V.E.S

That's one of the differences you'll see across the pond. We call them vaccum tubes.

Luke

There are a few SS amps out there that I would take in a heartbeat over 75% of the tube amps out there. SS has came a long way!!!


Originally Posted by alecleeA good amp is a good amp. An amp that doesn't sound good ain't worth the money regardless of price or construction.

1

It´s not quot;Tube or SSquot; you need to ask, but simply take your guitar with you and ask yourself quot;Do I like what I´m hearing?quot; quot;Can I live with this tone or do I love it?quot;....

The only time tube or not should play a role in amp choice (ESPECIALLY before actually playing a few) is if you can´t afford to buy new tubes every 6 months to year