software

This classic juxtaposition appears again, but now from a bit of a different position:

If we compare the quality of a japanese, import Jackson to a ESP standard series (No LTD stuff here, folks!), which one comes out on top and by what kind of margin? I'm not interested in a comparison of Jackson MIA vs. ESP japanese or LTD vs. jpn Jackson. The reason I choose these contenders is because they are in the same price range here in Finland. Not in the US, but here. Now, tell me how well they are made, how good are their woods etc. You know the drill.If we'd like some specific guitars, how about the new KB rhoads: from : localhost/and ESP Maverick (Sorry, not available in the US, but the most interesting one to me. It's quite comparable to a M-II, except that it has gibson scale and neck sc) from : localhost/Fire away!

To tell you the truth, my Jackson SL-4 (japense) rivials the quality of a USA made soloist. No kidding!


Originally Posted by theodieTo tell you the truth, my Jackson SL-4 (japense) rivials the quality of a USA made soloist. No kidding!

Is it an exceptional one or a standard one from the line? I mean that is this the norm or did you get lucky? Did you order it blindly or give it a test drive first? Is there a big difference between yours and the other jap ones you've tried?

The reason why I'm so inquisitive is as here in Finland, at least where I live, there is no place to actually test drive guitars before buying. You have to mail order them from 600 or 1600 km away. Not that one could base a real opinion after half an hour of testing in a shop, anyway.

Thanks for your thoughts, keep 'em coming, please!


Originally Posted by Johtosotku...
If we compare the quality of a japanese, import Jackson to a ESP standard series (No LTD stuff here, folks!), which one comes out on top and by what kind of margin? I'm not interested in a comparison of Jackson MIA vs. ESP japanese or LTD vs. jpn Jackson. The reason I choose these contenders is because they are in the same price range here in Finland. Not in the US, but here. Now, tell me how well they are made, how good are their woods etc. You know the drill....!

Should the Japanese ESP really be cheaper or comparable and the USA Jackson much more expensive, then even I would go for the ESP.

While Jackson Japan is very high quality and almost comes near the USA Line, you´re comparing a handbuilt guitar to an assembly line instrument, there is no comparison... This is exactly the same as comparing Jackson USA to LTD, it just doesn´t work, one has a totally different emphasis and price....

But Finlands distributors or JCMI must really be ****ed in the head if this is really true, because almost everywhere else (including most of Europe) the USA Jackson and Jap ESP are comparable in price..... I imagine with that pricing that Jackson sells almost zero guitars in Finland, and definitely no USAs becasue the´d be competing with PRSs and other Eye Candy.....

BTW, the M-II is a quot;Standardquot; Dinky shape, whereas the Maverick is based on ESP´s own quot;901quot; series... if you want an M-II you´ll need to buy an M-II

Jackson's low end is made in Japan, whereas ESP's high end is made there. I'd think the ESP's would be better, seeing that we're talking about ESP's high end range vs Jackson's mid-lower range.

BTW, have you checked out the Horizon?


Originally Posted by ZerberusShould the Japanese ESP really be cheaper or comparable and the USA Jackson much more expensive, then even I would go for the ESP.

I never thought I'd ever see you say that

From my understanding, ESP's primary factory is in Japan. They're a Japanese company and their standard and custom lines are handmade. Think of them as the Gibson of Japan.

On the other hand, Jackson is based in America. They outsource their labor to places like Korea and Japan while making their standard and custom lines in America.

Between the two, I'd pick ESP. Jackson's Japanese line is good, but their American line is better.


Originally Posted by ZerberusBut Finlands distributors or JCMI must really be ****ed in the head if this is really true, because almost everywhere else (including most of Europe) the USA Jackson and Jap ESP are comparable in price..... I imagine with that pricing that Jackson sells almost zero guitars in Finland, and definitely no USAs becasue the´d be competing with PRSs and other Eye Candy.....

The KB Rhoads, without a case, 1050#8364; shipped from Thomann.

The Maverick, with a case, 1379#8364; MAP in Finland.

EDIT: Jackson US solid color KE2, from Thomann, 2310#8364; shipped. The ESP in question is nearly 50% of that price. In Finland, IIRC, the price for an SL2H was 2740#8364;. A PRS MAP is about 2500#8364;.Originally Posted by ZerberusBTW, the M-II is a quot;Standardquot; Dinky shape, whereas the Maverick is based on ESP´s own quot;901quot; series... if you want an M-II you´ll need to buy an M-II

I didn't know that about the body shape, I could see that it was different. Do you happen to know what it's like in action, is it comfortable etc.? The price difference is 100#8364; between M-II and Maverick here. I mentioned the M-II as a comparison point in ESPs, which I consider to be the closest one.Big thanks for your help! If even you, who I think that really knows about guitars and quot;dislikesquot; ESP, think like that, I must be influenced by it!


Originally Posted by Rotten Guitar StringJackson's low end is made in Japan, whereas ESP's high end is made there. I'd think the ESP's would be better, seeing that we're talking about ESP's high end range vs Jackson's mid-lower range.

Well, those were my thoughts as well. I'd like some first-hand experience, though.

QUOTE=Rotten Guitar String]BTW, have you checked out the Horizon?[/QUOTE]

I've checked it, but it doesn't really speak to me that much. And costs quite a much extra, hah! I'm stretching already with these limits that I've set.

Thanks!


Originally Posted by frigginalexFrom my understanding, ESP's primary factory is in Japan. They're a Japanese company and their standard and custom lines are handmade. Think of them as the Gibson of Japan.

On the other hand, Jackson is based in America. They outsource their labor to places like Korea and Japan while making their standard and custom lines in America.

Between the two, I'd pick ESP. Jackson's Japanese line is good, but their American line is better.

Yeah, I'm inclined to think that way too. Thanks for your thoughts!

Joh, how did you find the MAP for the ESP? I can't find any ESPs here other than the American ones . Thomann only seem to carry them along with some of the sig models.


Originally Posted by PierreJoh, how did you find the MAP for the ESP? I can't find any ESPs here other than the American ones . Thomann only seem to carry them along with some of the sig models.

What do you mean by the american ones? I think that you can get a japanese M-II for 1469#8364; from Thomann. Check them out.

Those MAP prices I got from the finnish distributor Check quot;bändikamatquot;, then quot;sähkökitaratquot; and then ESP and you've got it.

I dont think there are American ESPs


Originally Posted by Rotten Guitar StringI dont think there are American ESPs

Me neither, at least new ones. Maybe if you're a high-class endorsee. But for the general public, no.

I meant the one on the US website, not the Japanese one, sorry.
That one: from : localhost/
The Mavericks, Edwards and all that aren't there and what European dealers seem to carry is only on this website. I really love some of the Edwards and also the Maverick you posted (quilted blue maple top with maple neck )


Originally Posted by PierreI meant the one on the US website, not the Japanese one, sorry.

For the japanese models available in Europe, check could have found that from my pic link as well. Cheers!

Yeah I know the models but noone who carries them


Originally Posted by PierreYeah I know the models but noone who carries them

Like I said, Thomann, in belgium, IIRC, germany, are three first ones in my mind, they ship abroad as well. Got to be more of them, too. Hope that helps!


Originally Posted by JohtosotkuThe KB Rhoads, without a case, 1050€ shipped from Thomann.

The Maverick, with a case, 1379€ MAP in Finland.

EDIT: Jackson US solid color KE2, from Thomann, 2310€ shipped. The ESP in question is nearly 50% of that price. In Finland, IIRC, the price for an SL2H was 2740€. A PRS MAP is about 2500€.

you can get an MII from Thomann for 1399 shipping... But while Thomann excels on anything cheap, he´s the last place on earth (after a certain notorious dealer in Vegas) that I´d buy a guitar, especially a Jackson.... He charges List price on those and heavily discounts the ESPs because nobody buys them but rather the LTDs with near identical features (ESPs biggest mistake so far, but Jackson made the same one twice),... comparison... There are a lot of places that are cheaper, though, even in Europe AFAIK....

I didn't know that about the body shape, I could see that it was different. Do you happen to know what it's like in action, is it comfortable etc.? The price difference is 100€ between M-II and Maverick here. I mentioned the M-II as a comparison point in ESPs, which I consider to be the closest one.
I wouldn´t be caught dead playing an ESP live, and sitting the neck is the biggest difference... between a ´96 901 and an M-II of the same era... as you may know the Standard line was discontinued a few years ago and only recently reissued, so no Idea how they are today

I still find it hard to believe that you can´t find a better price on a USA Jackson, though, I can usually get them here brand new for way less than Thomanns price, even cheaper if I buy stateside and Import it myself

Yep I've checked them all out but guitarbargains, I didn't know about it, maybe they'll have some, thanks!
Edit: ah yeah they have LOADS on guitarbargain... sweeet.
Zerb, aside from the JCF dealers, how do you get those cheaper Jacksons here in Europe if I may ask?